wukong wrote:

QUOTE:
I'll speak from my actions and the reason for them.

One way to put it is that I give more attention to fat and/or unattractive women but, really it's just because there's no intimidation and no attraction. I'm more courteous and smiley toward women, whether right or wrong, that's just how it is. It's also my observation and own interpretation (meaning, I don't know if this is how it really is; I recognize it is very likely just my perception) that fat women, good looking or not, are less reserved with their body language or facial expressions when they are attracted to a guy. My explanation to that is due to a fat woman is eager for male attention where a fit women does or is able to take it for granted.

This is just my take. My understanding of men, myself, and my experiences tell me that most men have attraction as one of their top emotional needs. There's some men where it is not, just like there are many women where it is. There is also the dynamic of desperation or as Shoom and Mary pointed out, looking for an easy lay.

Wow! I am completely the opposite when it comes to being around attractive fit women and unattractive ones. I have found that many attractive women are starving for attention due to men assuming they are stuck up and many fellow women hating on them. I make it very clear with them I have no agenda and that I am happily married and it is great from there. I have experienced that these fit women have a better outlook on life, self image, and hardly none of the man-bashing attitude the "Oprahlites" have. They don't sermonize on and on about how men should prefer "this and that" and blah blah blah.

I ride the train and subway every workday and I get lots of people sitting next to me and this dynamic almost always plays out.

I'm definitely not saying that there couldn't be large women whom most men would find wildly attractive.

But on the other hand I think that this (highly controversial) Brazilian ad-campaign for a light-yoghurt sort of sums it up:
http://www.popbytes.com/archive/2007/06/controversial_yogurt_ads_from_brazil.shtml
'Forget about it, men's preference will never change.'

Sunshine08 wrote:
Butterfly,
You know your implication suggests that fat women, because they're overweight, have no other redeeming qualities, other than to be a piece of 'meat' for any man who doesn't have a "preference" for their body type. A classic 'Freudian slip', I must say.

Anyway....
The mere suggestion that fat women have nothing else to offer as human beings just because of they're fat is, once again, a gross misconception - and rather stereotypical. But, if this is true, according to your theory Butterfly, even "fit" male/female relationships can be reduced to nothing more than the physical, and "fit" women are only sought after - and used - for their body-type. Which, when held up to the dysfunction of our current culture, could be debated; however, because the shoe is on the other foot, I'm sure you'll quickly disagree. Because you seem to buy into the (sexist) socialization that all fat people are "bad" and all fit people are "good"..
.[/quote]

This thread isn't about you, Sunshine, and it certainly isn't about 'what fat/obese women have to offer'. Its about attraction in a bar-type setting and whether or not an obese woman would get more attention than a fit woman.
And we'll just have to take opposite sides on this one because there is no way a fit and quality man would walk by a fit woman to pursue and obese woman for a serious relationship UNLESS he has that preference.
This is my opinion and my experience. Sure I had guys be nice to me when obese, and even make passes but I seriously doubted the motive behind them was attraction.
Now, as a fit(ish) woman - totally different. The way they make passes and the words they use to express themselves is definitely not the same.

butterfly wrote:

QUOTE:

This thread isn't about you, Sunshine, and it certainly isn't about 'what fat/obese women have to offer'. Its about attraction in a bar-type setting and whether or not an obese woman would get more attention than a fit woman.
And we'll just have to take opposite sides on this one because there is no way a fit and quality man would walk by a fit woman to pursue and obese woman for a serious relationship UNLESS he has that preference.
This is my opinion and my experience. Sure I had guys be nice to me when obese, and even make passes but I seriously doubted the motive behind them was attraction.
Now, as a fit(ish) woman - totally different. The way they make passes and the words they use to express themselves is definitely not the same.

Butterfly,

This is a public forum, and anyone with common sense can comprehend that contributing to an online community is an exchange of varying ideas & opinions. No given thread is about anyone in particular, and I have a clear understanding this isn't about me, per se, nor is it about you, per se. With that being said, you're not informing me of something I don't already know.

Just because you have a different experience than me doesn't mean that yours is "right" and mine is "wrong" or vice-versa. For this reason, I can certainly agree to disagree.

Attraction is obviously not all physical and can be a weird thing. I've met very very attractive women who after spending five minutes with them and experiencing there personality they can seem very ugly indeed.

Conversely you can meet someone who you don't find attractive at first then you talk their personality shines and you can be really attracted. Sense of humor, for a lot of people, can be a great influence.

The scientific explaination of 'The function of attraction' is for you to find the healthiest genes you can mix with your own i.e beauty is a sign of fitness. In fact if you think about your genes have a root stretching right back to the earliest life (goey blobs). Others just died off because they're not attractive/fit for the environment or just plain unlucky.

Not sure how that works with homosexuality Then theres pedophilia, necrophilia etc. All these occur in
nature so you cant explain them away with 'culture'

Thing is the 'sexual attraction' is important and is hard wired in the brain and our brains are complex things to state the obvious. Then (to contradict myself) lump on religion, culture, upbringing etc. When I was India 18 years ago a male with a fat belly was attractive because it was a sign of ability to acquire food and wealth.

Thing is you cant rationalize it and you cant con yourself into thinking someone is really attractive. I know from myself sex, love and physical attraction are intertwined and if one is missing like oxygen from fire it dies.

Sorry if i've rambled a bit.

I should add ref: first two paragraphs, they even physically seem less/more attractive to me

Good God I fancy her

Fancy who shoom?? The hot neighbour? Is that who you mean?

Mary45 wrote:

QUOTE:
I'm definitely not saying that there couldn't be large women whom most men would find wildly attractive.

But on the other hand I think that this (highly controversial) Brazilian ad-campaign for a light-yoghurt sort of sums it up:
http://www.popbytes.com/archive/2007/06/controversial_yogurt_ads_from_brazil.shtml
'Forget about it, men's preference will never change.'

I thought those ads were awesome and so deliciously politically incorrect, i.e. the obvious truth. We live in a disgustingly bassackwards world where good is bad and bad is good. Where truth is shunned and denial and acceptance of bad (meaning unhealthy or destructive; whether physically, mentally, or spiritually) is promoted and sometimes enforced.

Shoom is spot on, attraction is part of a whole that must exist in a relationship. Of course certain aspects of a person fulfill the attraction part differently for different people. For some, physical attraction isn't as high on their priority (emotional needs list), and some may even prefer what is not considered attractive to most.

There are girlfriends(friends that were female) that I had in my life that I just couldn't have an intimate relationship with for reasons of attraction, be it their face and/or their body. I'm sure this is true for every single person on this forum. You can apply this attraction to physical beauty, personality, success, etc. and it all comes down to the same thing - preference. Just because there are exceptions to a rule, that does not nullify the rule. It's a rule because it is mostly true, and the truth here is that most men and women are attracted to fit bodies not fat ones.

markerbull wrote:

QUOTE:
wukong wrote:

QUOTE:
...

Wow! I am completely the opposite when it comes to being around attractive fit women and unattractive ones. I have found that many attractive women are starving for attention due to men assuming they are stuck up and many fellow women hating on them. I make it very clear with them I have no agenda and that I am happily married and it is great from there. I have experienced that these fit women have a better outlook on life, self image, and hardly none of the man-bashing attitude the "Oprahlites" have. They don't sermonize on and on about how men should prefer "this and that" and blah blah blah.

I ride the train and subway every workday and I get lots of people sitting next to me and this dynamic almost always plays out.

What you say makes sense, can we trade experiences?? I'm curious to why the difference in our experiences.

The spot I bolded you just put so well! I'll spare all of you a rant on this but, this is so ridiculously and painfully true, one major factor in the reason for less people marrying per 1000 people.